grumman tiger vs cessna 172

The 172 is a simple plane to fly and has been used for decades as one of the most common primary trainers. With afixed-pitch prop and fixed gear, its simple to operate. According to Greg, the 115-hpCitabria burned about 5 to 6 gph, making it economical to operate. This is at least the third Tiger thread in two days. same friendly, informative place for all things Cessna 172, now with a larger The Tiger was designed by Grumman engineers and was first produced in late 1974 as the 1975 model. With a, fixed-pitch prop and fixed gear, its simple to operate. This appealing blend can be found elsewhere, but few options supplement it with the robust network of parts, service and support enjoyed by Grumman owners. With a fuel burn at cruise of around 5 GPH, she does better than my Chevy S10. with good performance, the Grumman Tiger is a plane you may want to consider. The system will It continued to look good until it was sold. What are your thoughts and experience? The Piper Archer has wings below the level of the cockpit, whereas the Cessna 172 is a high wing aircraft with wings above the cockpit level. This effectively provides Tiger speed and climb performance at the price closer to that of a Cheetah. Compared with those from other manufacturers, the Grumman design replaces many of the cables and pulleys with torque tubes. Combined with a panoramic canopy, nimble handling, relatively modest prices and thriving owners groups, the resulting blend of strengths makes these Grummans intriguing options for new and experienced owners alike. 1. If you have an autopilot, its a wonderful cross-country bird, Greg said. The Flying Educators Tiger has a two-axis autopilot so it frequently flies under IFR. Otherwise I can take a photo of the for sale sign at the airport sometime. Bill & Carol Scott, who own the high-compression STC, don't have the resources to do the full testing and certification protocol themselves, so the modified Cheetah is artificially limited to 157 hp to conform to the original specs. I believe the wing is a time life item and the end of the plane. The most affordable single-engine planes. This isn't chump speed, since the AA-5, by virtue of its slab-sided honeycomb panel fuselage, is hardly slick in the drag department. It s the same friendly, informative place for all things Cessna 172, now with a larger group of pilots and state-of-the-art forum software. I did. first Tiger policy premium was $2,360 in 1996, which was slightly higher than the Citabria. I must admit to being biased here. After 5 years I wonder if the deal was done. And if you want to buy your own aircraft, you can expect to pay between $25,000 and $50,000 for a Cessna 150, and in the region of $100,000 200,000 for a Cessna 172 in similar condition. And that was the main consideration.. Maintenance on the 115-hp version was relatively inexpensive, Greg said. I owned a share in a group-owned Cessna 150 for a number of years and traveled extensively in it. Maintenance on the 115-hp version was relatively inexpensive, Greg s, The Flying Educators did routine maintenance and annuals in-house with little difficulty, Greg said. If your club wants to offer something different yet cost effective, a Citabria can help attract members who want to earn a tailwheel endorsement or do some aerobatic flying. Even if you dont use the Citabria for aerobatics, there is something romantic about flying a taildragger with a stick particularly one that is light and responsive to control inputs. So what are both these Cessna aircraft like to fly? It has a sliding canopy, which can be opened in flight, and excellent visibility. Fold down back seats make an awesome cargo hauler with over 6-1/2 feet of room. Bede designed the two-place BD-1 with an emphasis on speed and economy, and when it was purchased by American Aviation and developed into the AA-1 series, these qualities were carried over. Grumman Tiger. If you fly a Tiger for 20 or 30 hours and get into a Cessna 172, it feels like a truck., You cant go wrong with either a Citabria or a Grumman Tiger in your club. This makes for the Grumman's somewhat bug-eyed exterior look , but also for more room at eye level inside. Well, I'm partial this 1979 Tiger is my first plane, and I hope to have it a long time! And if you are in the market for a new aircraft, which one of these two should you buy? Canopy is great when taxiing in the summer and in the pattern. If not, then which is best? Cheetahs are around 850lbs. But we were both fairly small, and we did have to limit ourselves to only a small amount of luggage, so as not to find ourselves with weight and balance issues. Topping the range is the AA-5B Tiger, which entered production as a 1975 model and differed from the Cheetah primarily by being equipped with the more powerful 180 hp Lycoming O-360. youll pay a premium based on your least experienced pilot. Grumman-American, on the other hand, never certified the AA-5x for 160 hp. Answer: You wont need a lot of extra tuition, but a few hours with an instructor would really be a good idea. ). the Forgot Password link. The most popular of the Grumman series, the Tiger seats four, has a 180-hp engine, and burns 10 gph. I'd take one over a 172 in a heartbeat. It will carry four people and luggage, and you have a wide choice, from completely new models to budget-priced much older ones. Enter your Username and Password to log in. get there? The Cessna 172, on the other hand, is still in production. Man erkennt eine AG-5B auch am T-frmigen Gashebel. Help me understand the wing structure. You can pay a whole lot less for a Traveler compared to a Tiger, or get a whole lot nicer Traveler for the same money. Insurance for our 1979 Citabria (Model 7-ECA) was $870 in 89 and had risen to $2,195 when we sold it in 95, Greg said. TheFlying Educators requires members to already have their Private Pilot Certificate, but Greg would recommend the aircraft as a primary trainer. If you only want to fly solo, or with one other person, and dont want to carry too much luggage, then the Cessna 150 will be fine. I know you can upgrade a Cheetah to 180 hp and essentially a Tiger. The Cessna 172. L14. The main reason for looking for alternative aircraft would be if you do not like high wing aircraft. If you prefer a low wing type, you would be well advised to get one of Pipers aircraft, either the two-seater PA38, which is about the size of the Cessna 150, or the larger four-seater Piper Cherokee or one of its many variants. Its a fixed gear, fixed-pitch prop so theres just not a whole lot that can go wrong with the airplane, Greg noted. Its nimble in the air, seats four, and has a good cruising speed with minimal fuel burn. As with the AA-5A, the AA-5B was continued in production by Gulfstream when they purchased Grumman's American division. Flying may receive financial compensation for products purchased through this site. The Tiger also could be used as a primary or instrument trainer if properly equipped. I've never heard anyone say the sliding canopy leaks. . The Cessna 172 is a lot more powerful than the Cessna 150. So this might well decide things for you. Tiger owner here. This helps tremendously because all of the cost of ownership, flight and maintenance are all shared equally among the 4 partners. Its hard to beat a tandem seat aerobatic aircraft when it comes to fun. Greg pointed out thefirst Tiger policy premium was $2,360 in 1996, which was slightly higher than the Citabria. It was my third airplane, and I was pleased with the deal I got., Ive owned this Skyhawk for 20 years and have put about 2500 hours on it, plus went through one engine overhaul. But I'm not sure you can do the same to a Traveler. ), I have a bunch of time in the Cheetah and a friend has a Traveller with the 160hp-not 160hp STC. Copyright 2023 Flying Media. She's published several books and articles on all things aviation and is eager to continue sharing her knowledge! That said, the Citabria is a good aircraft to use for tailwheel training. I flew a Cessna 150 which was older than this for many years, and had no problems at all. Before I bought my Grumman Tiger, I was in a flying club and flew a Cessna Cardinal. I only have time in the AA1X series, the baby brother of the tiger, the canopy design I think is one of the better ones in GA, no issues, the free castor nose wheel was great for ground handling, nice shock absorbing and strong fiberglass mains, good fuel tank system, etc. What are real world numbers for these two at 75%? Externally the Tiger looked much like the AA-5 Traveler and AA-5A Cheetah so once again Grumman's marketing department came up with a distinctive decal package to differentiate the design this time a "galloping tiger". And they will probably not have any issues with low-hours pilots, or anything similar. 2023 Aircraft Owners and Pilots Association. I've never heard anyone say the sliding canopy leaks. Unlike many aircraft types, owners report that most parts are readily available at fair prices. UBB Message. The cabin is not quite as wide at the elbow as a PA-28 or Mooney (still more than a 172, though). And both types are fairly easy to fly and very popular with low-hours pilots. moved! While the difference between the two is by no means huge, the 152 is the more economical option. If you currently have an account on Pilots Place, your Load carrying capability. The cockpit of the Cessna 150 is very cramped. With the assistance of aircraft designer Roy LoPresti, the airframe was cleaned up to reduce drag, the horizontal stabilizer was enlarged to increase elevator authority and expand the CG range, and fuel capacity went from 37 to 52 gallons. Very rugged, durable and dependable. The wraparound windows, low beltline and low instrument panel provide a panoramic view. Considering pre-flight, trip time, rides to and from airports, etc., it was faster driving on any trip less than about 200 miles. Depends. The manufacturing history of the AA-5 series is a colorful one. Have you forgotten your login information? Tiger owners report cruise speeds of 125 to 133 knots at 8.5 to 10 gallons per hour, while owners with 160 hp Cheetahs fly about 10 knots slower with a slightly lower fuel burn. Theres also a lot of wood in the Citabria, like under the seats, that needs to be inspected,andthere can be rusty tubes in the tail. It is, nevertheless, an item to confirm during a pre-purchase inspection. On average, I can see 100 MPH while spinning the prop at just around 2300 RPM., I have owned two Cessna 150s, an F model that I purchased new in late 1965 and an M model that I purchased 39 years later in the fall of 2004. To provide a more up-to-date cost perspective, the Wild River Flying Club in Osceola, WI operates a 1979 Citabria with a 150-hp Lycoming O-320. The most popular of the Grumman series, the Tiger seats four, has a 180-hp engine, and burns 10 gph. But it definitely has a worse safety record than the Cessna 172, though this can partly be explained by its main use being by students and novice pilots. It is such an OWT there's even a guy who makes satirical videos about it. The Tiger was the outcome of the same redesign work on the AA-5 Traveler that resulted in the 150 hp (110 kW) Cheetah and it was originally little more than the same aircraft . n, and a lot of fun to fly. It's kinda underpowered for what we were doing with it, luckily no one was heavy and the distances weren't far. They have an unnamed policy, meaning they dont have to list their members or their flight time, so anyone who joins the club is insured. At these airframe weights, 20hp buys a good bit of forgiveness. Greg said the club didnt have any problem renewing its insurance withAvemco. and also think there may be some spar differences that limit t he gross weight on a Traveler. It holds 52 gallons and has a range of about 700 miles. The Flying Educators isan equity clubfounded in 1962based at Ft. Lauderdale Executive Airport (KFXE). Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by Groundpounder, Jul 7, 2018. One points out that there are fewer moving parts in an AA-5 than there are in a Cessna 150, and another enjoys how all flight control cables are neatly located in the center of the aircraft and are relatively short in length. But the Cessna 150 is not unsafe by any means. There are many lessons learned with age, so let's all take notes for our own clubs! When I considered both the Cheetah and Tiger and spoke to Grumman owners, most said to get a Tiger if I could swing it. Find more About Us here! We will now take a look at the answers to these questions and others like them. $37.09 + $15.58 shipping . ). And, if you are doing aerobatics, you need parachutes that need to be repacked regularly, which would add a cost. Gross weight was increased from the AA-5/AA-5A's 2,200 lb (1,000 kg) to 2,400 lb (1,100 kg) on the Tiger. Flying Educators requires members to already have their Private Pilot Certificate, but Greg would recommend the aircraft as a primary trainer. The four-place Grumman AA-5 family might be one of the better-kept secrets, offering the simplicity of a Cessna 172 while approaching the cruise speed of a similarly powered Mooney. Did your friend get that on a field approval? login you will see the new forum. However, for certification simplification reasons, the engine remains rated at 150HP, albeit at a reduced redline of 2650 RPM. Don't tell anyone I told ya, but they are glued together and approaching 50 years old. Id take a Tiger or a Cheetah over a 172, every day of the week. Finding a good mechanic that has tube and fabric experience and expertise is important, and it could be a little more challenging to find than someone used to working on 172s or Cherokees. Visibility is amazing. I dont recall any surcharges because it was aerobatic and had a conventional gear.. But being a little more impartial, I would have to choose the Cessna 172, in particular the more recent models. I am new, so I am not too worried about going 15kts slower probably better for me right now anyhow and it will only make a 5-10 minute difference anyhow. Like any aerodynamically efficient airframe, proper speed management is important on approach and landing. Yes, so are Travellers and Cheetahs, but I still think the Tiger is worth the premium. The reports of excellent visibility are not overstated: The wraparound windows, low beltline and low instrument panel provide a panoramic view. ne cruised at around 115 mph and had about a 20-gallon fuel tank, Greg recalled. Am I safe to buy a Cheetah, get IFR and build 200 hours then sell -- or will I get bored before then and wish I would have waited for a Tiger? Depending on how much exposure it has to the sun, it will need to be replaced generally about every 25 to 30 years. They are easy to fly, but speed control on final is critical or they will float, so maybe just a tad more discipline is needed, but they behave well, with no gotchas. If you had a Tiger without the autopilot, its not going to be quite as stable as a 172 or a 182. It also makes a nice IFR-platform if it is properly equipped. Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by BellyUpFish, Aug 29, 2011. Has that been resolved and/or what years should one stay away from? For a club with a 30-year history flying only. And a little more economically.. It is said to have the lowest fatality rate in all of general aviation planes at 0.56 per 100,000 flying hours. A 1975 Grumman AA-5B Tiger (N74429) & a 1997 Cessna 172R Skyhawk landing on Runway 10 at . A number of these became known as Gulfstream Americans when Gulfstream bought the Grumman line and sold them through 1979. You cant go wrong with either a Citabria or a Grumman Tiger in your club. , The specs list the cruise speed at 139 knots, but Greg said the. Additionally, the airplane can be flown with a partially open canopy, which improves the experience even further. He enjoys researching obscure aviation history and serves as a judge for the National Intercollegiate Flying Association. It continued to look good until it was sold. I don't know the details of his financial situation, but I think he could pop for a Tiger without breaking a sweat. Grumman produced the AA5B Tiger from 1975 through 1979, and then American General produced the AG5B Tiger from 1991 through 1993. Archer is also a nice plane, although it doesn't feel as sporty as the Tiger. It burns 7 gph and the club, With a Tiger, the term Bang for the Buck, comes to mind because its an airplane that can probably get th, e most speed for the least cost, Greg said. It was this way even before I did the upgrades. Three or four of the 10 members would use it for aerobatics a lot. Greg said. Because there are so many of them, and they have been around a long time, there are a large number of mechanics and engineers who are familiar with what needs to be done to keep them in good working order, and obtaining parts for them should not be an issue either; they are easily available, even for the older Cessna 150s. The club uses, and pays $6,000 a year, but Greg noted that Florida is an expensive, to insure an aircraft because of hurricanes and the fact the state is highly litigious. I think the only way I would chose the Traveller of the Gruman line was because I could get a good airframe and avionics package and upgrade to 180hp cheaper than I could buy a Tiger for, and I don't really see that happening. front so youve got good visibility, and, like the Champ it is derived from, it is an easy, forgiving airplane. Aero on Demand, a Houston-based club, also operates a Tiger and it is equipped with an engine monitor providing very accurate data. The Aircraft Spotlight feature looks at an airplane type and evaluates it across six areas of particular interest to flying clubs and their members: Operating Cost, Maintenance, Insurability, Training, Cross-Country, and Fun Factor. Fuse to Circuit Breakers - Grumman Style: Replacing your old fuse holders with Klixon 7277-2 series circuit breakers. Bill & Carol Scott, who own the high-compression STC, don't have the resources to do the full testing and certification protocol themselves, so the modified Cheetah is artificially limited to 157 hp to conform to the original specs. It includes a touch-and-go,. The Cessna 172 is a lot heavier and more powerful than the Cessna 150, and when I did this conversion I found the Cessna 172 difficult to manage at first. One letter called the new Cessna 172 "the rough technological and stylisticequivalent of a 1966 Chevy Novaat the price of two Mercedes." Another called the announced $124,500 base price of the new Skyhawk"incredible" and suggested that $75,000 or $80,000 would be appropriate. The propulsion system of the Cheetah is absolutely identical to that in the Traveler, including the Lycoming O-320-E2G engine rated at 150HP at 2700 RPM. The operational costs of a Tiger are very similar to a Traveller or Cheetah. One maintainer reports that the majority of incidents he sees are a result of runway overruns that began with excessive speed on final approach. It introduced an enlarged version of the AA-1, equipped it with a 150 hp Lycoming O-320 and called it the AA-5 Traveler. You solo it from thefront so youve got good visibility, and, like the Champ it is derived from, it is an easy, forgiving airplane. Its super tight on the controls. We havent had any major problems with the Tiger.Aero on Demand said annuals without squawksrun about $1,200 depending on the going rate in your part of the country. Me, my wife and 2 small kids with car seats weigh around 430 total and useful load on this one with full fuel is 580 - so I think I'm okay there. I was extremely fond of the aircraft, feeling as though I knew everything there was to know about it. Jason McDowell. Get the Tiger, you local flights will get boring after 100 hours and you'll want to stretch out to further destinations. ). For more than 30 years, the 10-member club owned a Citabria. When we're not in the air, we're here helping others how to join us here at Aviator Insider. Picture . With relatively few problem areas, ADs or areas of concern with regard to flying characteristics, the AA-5 family checks many of the boxes required to earn its place as an approachable aircraft. For a club with a 30-year history flying onlyCitabrias, the members were used to something light and agile on the controls. Click Attention Cessna 172 Club Members! Nope. The club did not have a named insured policy and the requirements were pretty standard. 180-hp Lycoming O360 burns 10 gph. Grumman Tiger Vs Cessna 150 - YouTube Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts.

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